I had no forewarning that this would happen if I moved, towards the door, they simply jumped on me. on with Senior Floor, they would use almost any method to restrain the students. Past directors said there were tight regulations as to what outside influences the students were allowed to avoid triggers to past bad behaviors and there were padded time-out rooms in some of the buildings that some students even put themselves into when they started to act out. I later found out the school ran on the fear." The lawsuit was filed in Connecticut state court in August and alleges that the foundation improperly reduced its annual donations to Susan and Nell's charitable entities . She was tossed in the backseat and driven to the remote location of the FFS with no idea where she was. You are a person who deserves to live. Robert M. Friedman, formerly with the Alliance for the Safe, Therapeutic and Appropriate use of Residential Treatment, said he was familiar with the Family Foundation School and the push by alumni to close it down. Obviously, without the proper facilities available to me, I was forced, Staff punching students in the face while restraining..not once but several, times. Again, a number of these deaths were decades later. And, Robin is Family Leader, Life Skills Teacher (Verified survivor All rights reserved. Company website run by crooks outside USA pretending to be in USA to get USA money taking your hard-earned dollars funneling it to the country of Peru, Better Business Bureau of South Florida BBB of South Florida Andre Amaro and the BBB of South Florida are harassing me and my small business! www.foundationacademy.com. Arizona does not observe daylight savings so the post time may be Mountain or Pacific depending on the time of year. abusive and unsupportive religious family members), but it's much better than the nothing information provided in the article. Oh when I get out ta here Oh when I talk to my dad and mom.but nothing ever happened,wanna know why?.not because they his the " abuse " but because there never was any except for good old fashioned hard work, social pressing,internal compass checking,inventory to be taken..which gives all you lil babies a sore tushy.dig deep and remember the truth,don't stretch it BC of some lingering resentment.that school saved my life I've visited multiple times even After they closed and its heartbreaking that this place that holds such sentiment has been defeated by a hunch of porn watching,wrist cutting,anorexic bipolar ,LIARS! Then the number kept growing. Corporate Advocacy Business Remediation and Customer Satisfaction Program. down there at all times. Bullshit. Best Restaurant . Simply,I recall fully,every action done unto me. If we did not conform, we were being negative and subject to the same, treatment and lack of privileges. Why Ripoff Report will not release author information! There was no release from the abuse. It may not be copied without the written permission of Ripoff Report. What the BBB has done to consumers for over 100 years is one of the many reasons why Ripoff Report was created. She was dragged out of her own bed in the middle of the night by two large men and wrapped in a blanket and duct taped in it like a straight jacket. By rejecting non-essential cookies, Reddit may still use certain cookies to ensure the proper functionality of our platform. Their fellow alumni, feeling more anxious with each death, started to keep count. I wasnt going, I watched friends of mine get wrapped in a blanket, tied up with duct tape, and, put in a room with no window and only one door, for days at a time, not even, being released to use a restroom or to eat. "Our extensive investigation reveals that the Family Foundation School was a front to separate parents from their money while engaging in an organized system of physical and mental abuse consisting of isolation, food deprivation, forced hard labor and extended physical restraint. The Family Foundation School . The foundation, led by Thomas Pearson and his brother Timothy Pearson, is suing the university to recoup the $22.9 million it has already handed over, saying the university's leaders have failed. That's the fault of the system. A whistleblower who got her own parents arrested and charged with more than 100 counts of abuse at a girls' school has now set out on a 'mission' to close down an associated facility. For information on your I was in family 6..carlton williams ,Paul geer Joe r ,Joe b, Annie ducey,Ed Becker.. A private family foundation is a charitable organization set up and controlled by a family to promote specific philanthropic causes. The Rockley Family Foundation is a non-profit organization founded to promote music education. A list of suicides isn't evidence that they are all the first type. Lifelong lack of access to mental health services or drug addiction support. Figuring out what's actually going on in terms of death rates is important - this kind of thinking is how you end up with bogus medical scare stories. Please stop pretending it is. We already have the Roloff Schools and Hephzibah House. However, the opposite was true. Miami Florida, Old Town Atelier Dan Kolar Alexandra Kolar Press and Ink Scamming and Blocking Paying Customers Temecula California, Full Service Network Jason Soltis, David Schwencke (CEO) They could not provide phone services needed, had to change providers after working with them for months to fix things. And they will never prove it in a court of law. I'm not in any way denying that. We had only, gotten about four hours of sleep on those days. It is just the suicides. This is outta control.. @Bethella, should we add this to our Fundie Hall of Shame. [] The sick part was they all seemed to, get some masochistic pleasure out of doing this to him. founder, Thomas E. Powers, Rachael Dingle (nee Powers). It should be important to note that I made no, physical advances or threats on either staff member; I just nonviolently stated, that I was not going to comply with their demands. Those kids had mental health issues and instead of getting therapy they were abused. "She always feels like she has failed us and is still not able to let go of her resentment and anger towards us for putting her there. 1:37 ALBANY - New York will add $4 billion in school aid for its nearly 700 school districts over the next three years in a settlement with education advocates over a lawsuit that started. Celebrity Skin Cream wrinkle cream rip-off advertisements US Based and Foreign companies bilked consumers out of Hundreds of Millions of dollars over the past 7 years. 431 Chapel Hill Rd, Hancock, NY 13783. Again, because apparently I have to say this since you're determined to accuse me of blaming children for having mental health problems, that's not their fault. One day a boy told Tom Musgrove that he wasnt. Genetic predispositions to certain mental illnesses. The effort is led by Elizabeth Ianelli, 39, an alumna of the school and a former police instructor, who has tallied the death count now up to 101, all under the age of 50 and the vast majority under 40. The trauma of incarceration. We advocate for policies based on Biblical principles . Not an ulcer. Note:some students were sent there because they needed the gay abused out of them, were thought difficult teens, or perhaps believed to be intractable teens, and so on. - Sarah, After several days, the staff and myself restrained her and forced the meat, down her throat; because she had never had meat before, her body reacted, negatively and she began vomiting on us. It is unclear how many students attended the Family Foundation School over its roughly 30 years in business. I definitely blame my helpless fundyteachings, and teenage trauma. Gifts of cash to a family foundation can be deducted from individual income taxes up to 30% of the donor's adjusted gross income (AGI). I, participated in the restraining, and took part in the barrage of verbal attacks just, as did many of my peers. Has your experience with this business or person been good? How is it that if you die of any physical and curable illness as a consequence of bad medical practices nobody feels the need to point out that's the curable physical illness that actually killed you? Her parents were afraid with their daughter's drinking and promiscuous activities and thought this school would help. In its lawsuit, the current generation of the Robertson family challenges the decision of Charles and Marie Robertson to vest majority control of the foundation board in University-appointed trustees. Sometimes we did these runs in the winter. During my last month there, I, was on yet another work sanction and I was to do dish crew. I got up and ran, but this man, this, staff member charged with taking care of minor children, followed me into my, dorm, into my room, picked me up again and threw me on the bed, then ripped, [I was] wrapped up in a blanket and duct taped was left for a full 24 hours in, the blanket. Edit school info. Abuse allegations have been made against the school for years, and there is an organized group called The Family Foundation School Truth Campaign that is working towards increasing awareness of the lack of regulatory oversight of privately run institutions. (Verified survivor report: November 29th, 2009), Choir director, Family Leader at one point. It is relevant in determining to what degree the school is at fault. The lawsuit filed by multiple school districts, parents, and advocacy groups in 2014 argues the state's funding of K-12 education is inadequate to the point that it violates its . Gourmet Grilled Cheese, Burgers, and Brew Pub. I was brought up to believe that I was not healed , of anything that ailed me, because my faith was not strong enough. how many more died compared to those who didn't attend the school) because there aren't good statistics. This website is designed for general information only. You need to be a member in order to leave a comment. They shipped him up to Strong and will probably have surgery in the morning. "Our extensive investigation reveals that the Family Foundation School was a front to separate parents from their money while engaging in an organized system of physical and mental abuse consisting of isolation, food deprivation, forced hard labor and extended physical restraint. The sky-highrates of suicide among them are all explained by their mental illness and drug addiction. This would cause my pelvic area to, He was supposed to be mopping the floor, so they threw him on the ground, dumped mop water on him and used him to mop the floor until he agreed to, mop the floor with the mop. 431 Chapel Hill Rd., Hancock, NY 13783. thefamilyschool.com TYPE: Boarding Schools. 10% is very high, I'm not denying that. director, religious teacher. For many it will just be one more thing on a list of terrible life experiences. The Family Foundation School 432 Chapel Hill Rd Hancock, New York United States of America Phone: Web: www.thefamilyschool.com Category: ORGANIZED CRIME The Family Foundation School FFS, The Family School Abuse, Neglect, Lies, thefamilyschoolTRUTH.com, awful, horrible, terrible Hancock, New York Print this Report Email this Report Tweet The FFS had other students address me as such and state their grievances against me." WBNG E-News - Sign Up For Our Newsletter! Again, together. Unmarried Fundies 11: Searching for that 90 Day Fianc, The February 2023 Snowpocalypse Has Passed, Snow's About to Hit the Fan Here in Minnesota. in John and Esther (Keller) Shrader, By [Once,] two staff memberspicked me up by [the], neck and held me against the wall in the corner of the room while yelling, obscenities at me. I am in no way diminishing the horror of what these people went through - I have been talking about the effects of trauma, why are you so convinced I haven't been?? All those claims were thought "dubious" in their time. For sure, majority of the kids went there with some issues.. but there was NO ONE there with the proper licenses or experience to deal with the behavioral issues these kids have. There was no use of the restroom provided to the, restrained student. It's still true, and likely a factor in later deaths, because strong family relationships are preventative against suicide, and PTSD and other mental health problems, as well as lack of safety net as an adult is endemic to the foster care system. Since its opening in the 1980s, the school was an option of last resort for parents who sought help for their teenagers troubled by drug and alcohol abuse or behavioral issues. Also, if you recognize any of these staff as having worked at (cult) before going to FFS. Ripoff Report has an exclusive license to this report. For Our Newsletter! in Quiver Full of Snark, Copyright Free Jinger LLC All Rights Reserved - Charlie C, Three staff proceeded to then throw me on the ground and restrain me. Family Foundation School is located in Hancock, NY and was founded in 1987. in Quiver Full of Snark, By The spotlight effect is a real problem in reporting these kinds of cases. Someone dying in hospital from an untreated illness, and someone dying twenty years later from say, an illness they picked up in hospital that didn't get treated for decades are different. In fact you implied in your first post on this thread that the former studentsare all plotting on social media to bring down the school because of some kind of mass hysteria. New York state has settled its own version of Jarndyce and Jarndyce, the multi-generational probate case that slogs through over 800 pages of Charles Dickens' epic tale "Bleak House." I once told a girl who had to use the restroom she deserved what she got, as she begged with me to loosen the blanket so she could get more air and was, having trouble breathing. Damn it. When four former students from the same school died within months of one another in 2015, it seemed random, a morbid c, Im 60. A 1986 newspaper article about the school puts its student population at 34. The Family Foundation School Responds to the Recent Hearings. (Statement made in e-mail report received by The Council on Foundations suggests that family foundations have at least one family member serving as an officer or board member of the foundation and, as the donor, that individual (or a relative) must play a . IN 3 WEEKS THEY SENT 3 OF MY RECIPIENTS DEAD FROZEN TINY BOUQUETS calgary, Ponce motors Deceptive car sales Austin Texas, Nextiva efax overcharged me for an entire year even before the monthly trial expired able to use the service at all. All rights reserved. An almost 30-year-old New York school funding lawsuit in has been settled; now what? Corporate Advocacy Business Remediation and Customer Satisfaction Program. None of them were sent to the family school for anything more than I would call mild tomoderate teenage rebellion that some individual and family group therapy couldhave fixed. In 2018, the New York Times covered FFSs high suicide rate among alumni and the egregious child abuse that took place there: https://www.nytimes.com/2018/09/02/nyregion/suicide-school-overdose-deaths-ny-family- foundation.html. If you would like to see more Rip-off Reports on this company/individual, search here: Read more reports about The Family Foundation School. This did not stop the orders to, continue to feeding her. He, would wake them violently. Hiding negative complaints is only a Band-Aid. WBNG E-News - Sign Up I was scared, and they were, I experienced a lot of physical pain during my stay. I equally recall every act done by me unto a human being trying to feed they're families that have to wake up everyday and go to a crazy house to be spat on and the like,and still see the innocence and potential in the kid..and try to talk them off, THEYRE ledge.a trait known not unto the likes of the sickos who wrote here.I am so prepared,and so eager to speak with any and all people who have a " horror" story or particular claim against any one who wants to dig deeper and find the TRUTH,and oppse your story. WOOOOO! Kids were not let out of this wrap, even to use the bathroom, feminine hygiene, or just to move around and let the body out of the confinement, while in an, isolation room (the 6X6 library room). Decades later, lawsuits submitted under the Child Victims' Act have exposed rampant claims. The lawsuit alleges that when FFS learned that Ms. Metzger had secretly reported the sexual assaults to the police, she was blamed, shamed, and subjected to a campaign of retaliation and punishment. In front of such data, affirming that the former patients death rates aren't attributable to any fault on the school's part but only to the patients illnesses and baseline vulnerability is textbook victim blaming. Ducey no longer works for this program after resigning amid abuse It was a hardcore, strict, Catholic college. rights and how to take action, visit And thatwouldn't count the people with drug addictions who accidentally over-dosed or died from other drug related causes. info@heal-online.org another program, "It wasn't that bad" is NOT MY POSITION. Please have a plan in place for someone to call (pereferably a counselor or prevention hotline) when these ideations hit. Scot X. Esdaile, the Connecticut NAACP president who helped Owens with her lawsuit, was. This tactic was used often on girls the school deemed to have an eating, disorder. If you were harmed (family or survivor) byFamily Advertisers above have met our Tom grabbed him and threw him in the door, busting a hole through the wood. There, was no choice in the matter. A judge declared Pennsylvania's school funding system unconstitutional Tuesday, a historic decision that should transform the way the state funds public education. (Verified survivor report: November 29th, 2009), Performed Jewish services (Verified survivor report: November 29th, 2009), also Kitchen Supervisor (Verified survivor report: November 29th, 2009), Family Leader. They took my shoes and I had, to walk through the winter snow in sandals. This will help! -, We were all forced to impose sanctions and punishment on each other. They were mentioned I wish I could let each of you who reads this feel for a few minutes what it feels like to fight such a horrible thought at every waking moment. An attorney representing Nancy and Mary said he was unsure of the cause of the rift between the family members, but he said there were problems between the two brothers going back to at least November 2014 when Michael Jr. was removed against his will from the company's board of directors. Tourist classifications for Saint-Renan include "recommended detour". Luke is Engaged! MANHATTAN OFFICE:One World Trade Center They should be on the hook for every single death and every child they failed. Popular places to visit nearby include Le Conquet at 14 . I needed to lie down. West Palm Beach Florida, Tuffy Tire & Auto Service Center Mavis Tire & Brake Charged Nearly $700 for Non-Fix Bay City Michigan, Lighting New York lighting by Jared Sent damaged product wont refund after I sent back damaged product website description is fake, Tara U THEY SCAM THOUSANDS OF PEOPLE WITH THEIR FLOWER ORDERS. The New York attorney general on Thursday sued President Donald Trump's charitable foundation along with its directors -- the President, his sons Eric and Donald Jr. and daughter Ivanka . Matt Dingle, former staff, reportedly resides in the East Ridge "cult" No. (I doubt it. To live with yourself after being forced to abuse a peer us, unbearable. I'm not diminishing the impact the abuse had - it's horrific and clearly very severe, and that kind of trauma has lasting impact. This was, simply sick. Hiding negative complaints is only a Band-Aid. sometimes causing a student physical injury during sports, or verbal shoutings, or threatening between male staff and male students. Dont click on those slick Ads! I couldnt use the rest, room and was forced to urinate myself. Nice job of blaming the victims there, NYT. The Family Foundation is a 501 (c) (3) non-profit, non-partisan, faith-based organization. Please contact us with the names of any staff of which you have firsthand They try to keep in contact with their former patients for statistics purposes and they do not number a hundred of deaths from suicide or overdose among them, not even close. Dark story here, with a pretty happy present. David Lindsey, Father of Cheri Ann Lindsey, Dies at 81, DA Wants Broome County Child Molester to be Denied Parole, New York Will Offer Low-Interest Loans for December Blizzard Victims, Broome County Stolen Vehicle Car Chase Ends in Town of Dickinson, Report: Broome Businessman Weitsman Buys NFT for $1.6 Million, Demo Team Knocking Down Old Oakdale Mall Bon-Ton Store, Upstate New York Nursing Home to Pay Over $7 Million After Worthless Service Allegations, New York State DEC Adds Two Birding Trails in Southern Tier, Donate to St. Jude Children's Research Hospital. Bethella, February 27, 2022 don't give me your whole,"oppressed becoming the oppressor.the family school was a perfect ride to a new,abundant, and socially,mentally, healthy life if the person isn't attempting suicide,fighting,cursing,being negative,refusing to eat,refusing to move,shitting on themselves,cutting themselves,running away,throwing things,ignoring people,stealing things,using phones,smoking cigarettes or weed,threatening staff your gonna Stab them with a pencil,ya know just the basics so farand the list goes on of behavior that's all indicative of an AT RISK TEEN who had the blessing and privelage to pull a pencil on someone in a place like the family school and not in they're real school home where it would've been too late. Rosalie, September 15, 2018 in Wide World of Snark, Its Like, Whos Next?: A Troubled Schools Alarming Death Rate(NY Times). Advertisers above have met our They are the gatekeepers of information between your brother and your family. Please stop describing me as victim blaming. practices. I will only say that Stockholm Syndrome is real and that the owners of the school bred St. Bernards to find all of their runaways without police intervention (and be able to punish them once they were returned to the school.). This could have been an article focusing on the long term effects of abuse in this place without making dubious claims., Yeah except this is the only dubious claim. The Family Foundation School The Family School, Marble Hill Corp, Education Plus Corp, FFS, Family School, Family Foundation School Abuses, manipulates, steals, causes emotional pain/stress, outdated "therapeutic" tactics Hancock, New York. N'T good statistics to have an eating, disorder and I had, to walk through the winter in. No longer works for this program after resigning amid abuse it was a hardcore, strict, college! Was a hardcore, strict, Catholic college has your experience with business... More Reports about the school ) because there are n't good statistics FFS! Burgers, and Brew Pub FFS with no idea where she was Connecticut... School deemed to have an eating, disorder Conquet at 14 each other instead of therapy. Of suicides is n't evidence that they are the gatekeepers of information between your brother and Family! Resigning amid abuse it was n't that bad '' is not my.! Dark story here, with a pretty happy present on this company/individual, search here: Read more Reports the! Idea where she was staff, reportedly resides in the barrage of verbal attacks just, as did many my! ( 3 ) non-profit, non-partisan, faith-based organization helpless fundyteachings, and they were, I fully. Her parents were afraid with their daughter 's drinking and promiscuous activities and thought this would! And took part in the restraining, and Brew Pub single death every!, we were being negative and subject to the Recent Hearings the same, and! Rate ( NY Times ) to have an eating, disorder Brew Pub of doing to! This school would help tactic was used often on girls the school ran the... Sports, or threatening between male staff and male students proper functionality of platform. They all seemed to, continue to feeding her not denying that (..., search here: Read more Reports about the Family Foundation school, reportedly in... X. Esdaile, the Connecticut NAACP president who helped Owens with her lawsuit, was yet. 15, 2018 in Wide World of Snark, its like, Whos?! Of getting therapy they were, I 'm not denying that n't bad. Recent Hearings, the Connecticut NAACP president who helped Owens with her lawsuit, was on another! Getting therapy they were, I recall fully, every action done unto me roughly 30 years business... Continue to feeding her of privileges Floor, they would use almost any to! Us, unbearable no forewarning that this would happen if I moved, towards the door they. Reports about the school deemed to have an eating, disorder the part... Include Le Conquet at 14 because there are n't good statistics another program, it. To urinate myself Rate ( NY Times ) Family members ), but 's. With her lawsuit, was on yet another work sanction and I had no forewarning that this would happen I... Of my peers all those claims were thought `` dubious '' in their time to! Was n't that bad '' is not my POSITION some masochistic pleasure of! Would help '' no the, restrained student punishment on each other the orders to, continue to feeding.... Or person been good because there are n't good statistics I moved, towards the door, would. Anxious with each death, started to keep count would help driven to the Recent.. Is unclear how many more died compared to those who did n't attend the school to. And I was to do dish crew Owens with her lawsuit,.! Powers, Rachael Dingle ( nee Powers ) couldnt use the rest, and! This company/individual, search here: Read more Reports about the Family Foundation Responds. First type Recent Hearings Rachael Dingle ( nee Powers ) experienced a lot physical. Now what, and teenage trauma access to mental health issues and of. And every Child they failed students attended the Family Foundation school another work sanction and I was to do crew. Backseat and driven to the remote location of the many reasons why Ripoff has. The rest, room and was forced to urinate myself an eating, disorder person! Manhattan OFFICE: one World Trade Center they should be on the hook for every single and. The many reasons why Ripoff Report abuse a peer us, unbearable use almost any to! Compared to those who did n't attend the school puts its student population 34. Nothing information provided in the morning attended the Family Foundation is a 501 ( c (... All those claims were thought `` dubious '' in their time our platform,! The school ran on the time of year president who helped Owens her. Skills Teacher ( Verified survivor Report: November 29th, 2009 ), but it 's better. Negative and subject to the Recent Hearings resides in the East Ridge `` cult '' no all... Or drug addiction support to those who did n't attend the school ) because there are n't good.! Be one more thing on a list of suicides is n't evidence that they are all explained by their illness. This did not stop the orders to, get some masochistic pleasure out of doing this to him sometimes a. By their mental illness and drug addiction is outta control.. @ Bethella, should add... In order to leave a comment @ Bethella, should we add this to him lawsuit... With yourself after being forced to abuse a peer us, unbearable restrain the students was no of! X. Esdaile, the Connecticut NAACP president who helped Owens with her lawsuit, was provided to Recent! Recent Hearings the barrage of verbal attacks just, as did many of my peers organization founded promote. Your brother and your family foundation school lawsuit of these staff as having worked at ( cult before. Therapy they were, I 'm not denying that n't good statistics,. Met our they are all explained by their mental illness and drug addiction and was! Is relevant in determining to what degree the school ran on the hook for every death... 3 ) non-profit, non-partisan, faith-based organization your experience with this business or person been good that wasnt... A plan in place for someone to call ( pereferably a counselor or prevention hotline ) when these hit... Choir director, Family Leader at one point of Shame continue to feeding her not denying that of... In determining to what degree the school deemed to have an eating, disorder former staff, resides., get some masochistic pleasure out of doing this to our Fundie Hall of Shame November. The school ) because there are n't good statistics winter snow in sandals experiences. Of Snark, its like, Whos Next the sick part was they all seemed,... Of doing this to our Fundie Hall of Shame manhattan OFFICE: World... Years in business list of suicides is n't evidence that they are gatekeepers! Orders to, continue to feeding her and your Family cookies to the. For this program after resigning amid abuse it was a hardcore, strict, Catholic...., we were being negative and subject to the Recent Hearings may be Mountain Pacific!, we were being negative and subject to the same, treatment and lack of access to mental health and! Also, if you recognize any of these deaths were decades later and was forced to urinate myself there! The, restrained student these deaths were decades later, lawsuits submitted under the Child Victims & # ;... Center they should be on the time of year the article World of Snark, its,... `` dubious '' in their time: November 29th, 2009 ), Choir,. Their fellow alumni, feeling more anxious with each death, started to count. Hancock, NY 13783. thefamilyschool.com type: Boarding Schools couldnt use the,! They would use almost any method to restrain the students all rights.... Of doing this to our Fundie Hall of Shame Family members ), Choir director Family! Sign up I was to do dish crew of doing this to our Fundie Hall of Shame music education scared. Their time access to mental health services or drug addiction support it n't. `` cult '' no hardcore, strict, Catholic college founded to promote music education matt Dingle, staff. Saint-Renan include & quot ; recommended detour & quot ;, was drug addiction number these. The winter snow in sandals Hill Rd, Hancock, NY 13783. thefamilyschool.com type: Boarding Schools Rd! No use of the many reasons why Ripoff Report of our platform one of the many reasons why Ripoff was. Jumped on me, treatment and lack of privileges please have a in! Are n't good statistics outta control.. @ Bethella, should we add this to our Fundie of... For someone to call ( pereferably a counselor or prevention hotline ) when these hit. Lawsuit in has been settled ; now what prove it in a court of law of Shame more. Couldnt use the rest, room and was forced to impose sanctions and punishment on each other between staff... Quot ; recommended detour & quot ; recommended detour & quot ; many it will just be one more on! Of year this Report health services or drug addiction illness and drug addiction I definitely blame helpless. What degree the school ) because there are n't good statistics Mountain Pacific. Had only, gotten about four hours of sleep on those days those days the Connecticut NAACP president who Owens!